Posts: 78
Joined: 2006-03-15
User Profile Well stright up...idk what the hell it is about, all i know is a few of my members are involved.I would like to know what exactly the creators of this Petition feel is unjust, and the moderators voice on the matter. I have no oppinon on this matter as of now, although there are a few things about ER i dont love...all in all i dont see a major problem. Especially the anger towards Bp, coming from sum1 who has bumped heads with him several times, i do have to say he is somewhat fair and has even shown me mercy in tornements he could of banned me for.
I dont know where else to post this, and im not trying to create a dispute...but i do think that hte community should handle it on these boards, lay down all the cards on the table and see whther or not the mods can ppossibly work on some of the complaints. I dont know how legit these complaints are, but i just dont want any more of my members signing something that will result in hurting them, their privledge to compete or their reputation here at these tornements.
Although i am simply 7DS'S leader I advise my members not to get involved until you know what its about. Ultimately it is your choice to sign but i just want to make sure that my members dont get punished for these actions. Id also rather deal with this straight up then boycotting tornements. ER is the only thing the RC community has to compete in and i dont want to see that messed up.
~Wrath
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Wrath... no one stops you "boycotting" these tournaments. Do what you think dude...
If you do not agree to our rules and for what ER stands for, leave these forums and let us in peace.
This stupid "disputes" are just immature in my point of view...
Posts: 78
Joined: 2006-03-15
User Profile Well not pointing fingers but i dont think the whole rc community should sit out tornements because of stupid disputes. I think that the ER scoring system is way too complex and hard to understand. BUT I also feel ER has done so much for this community and any tornement(besides a ladder torny) would have an odd scoring system.
But part of being a mod is dealing with stupid kids who dispute poop for no reason. It's your job and u can't complain when some1 is merely abiding by your rules....it my be OVER abiding(lol) but i dont see a valid arguement.
I don't dislike ER enough to boycott it, unless the boycotees(lol boycotees) Explain what the hell they want changed.
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Heh ... I don't think so that the whole RC community is boycotting ... and this won't happen.
Just a bunch of people. If you look at the "petition" there are only 4 or 5 people signed .. so it's just nothing.
And currently nothing's wrong with ER and we're getting some new mods.
So Wrath please chill down and be patient ... the last topic about this issue is a week ago and you post this crap again..
Wait till bp posts an official announcement about our new mods etc.
DO NOT OPEN MORE THREADS ABOUT THIS TOPIC ANYMORE. WE ARE WORKING ON IT. THANK YOU!
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Wrath I understand your confusion here.. I am too for the most part... Let's all be honest here, that is the least we can do.
If you have a complaint about something then please post it; we're here to help and make sure events are smooth and fun for everbody.
Wrath to address you confusion about the scoring system I will do my best to explain it here for you and anyone else.
----
The scoring system:
Games (number of matches)- This is th first stat we see when looking at the carts, it's simple, the person with the most games gets the max score in that stat. Everyone else gets their number of games divided by themax number of games. So say Wrath has 50 games and I have 32. my score for the stat would b 32/50 (.64). So Wrath gets 10 points because he has the most and I get 6.4 points.
Victory Ratio (number of games wonover number of games lost) -Total over 25 points can be earned if you have the highest victory ratio. Say I have played 10 games and lost 4; my victory ratio would be 2.0. If someone were to have a higher victory ration say, 8.5. Then that person wouldhave 25 points in that stat and I would have 6.64.
Avg. Flags and Kills per game depend on the event type. I can go into them if nessisary.
Unique Opponents (Number of different people you play) - So I have played 10 games and I have 15 different people I played.
The above stats are all added up. The number in the bracket is added up and then that number is then muliplyed by this next stat, which brings the score it it's final place.
Avg. Rating played (The difficulty of people you have played, par event, not total rankings) - This stat is based off the people you have played. Say you play Wrath who is currently ranked 6th and his partner who is ranked 7th. Playing them if you are below them in rank will help your score. If you are ranked above them, you will not be hurt badly by playing them, however, if you had not played someone ranked that low it would lower your ARP a little bit, but nothing substasal. But if you played someone who was ranked 49th and someone who was ranked 30th and you where above both players, that would make a noticable inpact on this stat. You are trying to keep your ARP as close to 1 as possible. If you have it lower it will hurt you, and the lower it is, the more it hurts you.
If you have any questions on the ranking system still please post them. If you have any conserns about ongoings at ER also please post them. However, I will not hesitate to deleat a post that is flaming or "fighing words". If you are serious here this topic can be helpful for everyone.
Thank you.
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Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Thanks Havick. I guess Wrath got it =)
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile Delete? All i said was whenever i try and start something(not in a bad way) but a suggestion or something, it gets delete or locked...
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Delete? All i said was whenever i try and start something(not in a bad way) but a suggestion or something, it gets delete or locked...
There was no reason to say that... I told you to post your thoughts here and for someone to just plainly say that it will get locked it counterproductive. If you have something you would like to say, say it; and don't ot say it because you think it will get locked... Don't complain about things if your not willing to say what things you think are wrong.
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile Delete? All i said was whenever i try and start something(not in a bad way) but a suggestion or something, it gets delete or locked...
There was no reason to say that... I told you to post your thoughts here and for someone to just plainly say that it will get locked it counterproductive. If you have something you would like to say, say it; and don't ot say it because you think it will get locked... Don't complain about things if your not willing to say what things you think are wrong.
alrigh then here is what i think. I think that bp is a great mod and leader of the ER Rep Com systems. but he doesnt play anymore, so im sure he gets a biased view of whats going on, so he cant truely see it. I think that there should be a time limit on the Er head admin. Like it should rotate, like a president. Server a 4 event term or something like that, and you can get re-elected. I think we should choose who should be the next admin. I also think, like i have stated, that all clans should have a rep.(Dont give me t he bullhocky about how they are chosen on merits rather than clans. What about Bobo or lee for RC? Or Fish or Bill from motr??
I think the RC community should have more say in who moderates their tournaments and I think we should have an election for the lead, and you can be lead for more than once, but there should be an election, and you choose from the mods.
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Thank you.
I personaly think that even though Bp doesnt play a whole lot any more that in debates he is a more clear and unbiased view of it then anyone else.
BP is a GD (Game director) though and that is up to Meal, not anyone else. I would just stick with the mod part of your argument for now... Steps.
Posts: 1056
Joined: 2005-06-08
Location: USA
User Profile I may not play much anymore but honestly Monk you have no clue on what is going on with ER the moderators. In addition you are not informed enough to make any decisions about who should or should not be moderating events. I have read your petition and basically what it comes down to is... You were not ignored, you sent me a PM (with an ultimatium), I gave you very complete explanation. However you ignored me in true Monk fashion, because you didn't get the answer that you wanted hear, so you turned around created a petition.
Here is my response once again:
I never said I didn't agree with "all major clans should have representation".. I just stated that moderator positions are not awarded to people based on their clan status.
Idealy, yes the larger more active clans would each have 1 moderator. However that is not always possible. I'm not going to just appoint someone a moderator b/c of their clan. The evaluation of whether a person should be a moderator should only reflect that person not their clan. If there is a person that is deserving and they are in a smaller they should naturally have the position, even more in the absence of qualified person from a larger clan. However if two people were equally qualified/deserving, as a last resort I would look at their clan (size and activity at ER) b/c as I said idealy we would want mods from larger clans.
This is clearing different than what you think I said.. So I hope this explanation helps you to understand where I am coming from. I never said it wasn't a good idea.. I think its a great idea, my point is that its more about getting the right person in the job, and not their clan.
I have said this 1000 times I don't think anyone deserves to be a moderator based on their clan status. I want honest reliable people to do this job, I think the membership deserves that and I would put that ahead of any other concern. As far as representation, every club has club and game captains which also have an open dialog to the moderators. The other thing is that for the last two years I have pretty much answered 99% of all PMs that I receive with in 2 days, that includes PMs from members, moderators, clan leaders, captains, etc.
-bp
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Location: USA
User Profile On a complete sidenote, and I maybe wrong.. But I don't think Wrath was directly questioning anything other than the petition itself. His second sentence is a question directed to the creator of the petition, and nowhere in his post does he questions the mods our decisions, etc. Infact he shows some support (thank you). Perhaps this was lost in translation when Vash replied, I maybe be reading too deep into this.. But I see no issue with his post and he was just stated his clans position and question the petition itself rather than the mod staff.
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile but i didnt create the petition, and i said it was wrong of me to sign it BP. I said in my post also, that you were a great mod and I just purposed an idea. which you totally went crazy on me.
Posts: 3
Joined: 2006-04-19
User Profile Well Monk, maybe it was the fact that you said he had become biased, and wasnt in touch with the community. Which was foolish to assume because Bp has been a Game Director/Mod for 2+ years. And as he said, has taken all these PM's and has helped forward the community for the past 2 years.
But hey, it is the RC community you come to expect these comments from day to day.
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile Well Monk, maybe it was the fact that you said he had become biased, and wasnt in touch with the community. Which was foolish to assume because Bp has been a Game Director/Mod for 2+ years. And as he said, has taken all these PM's and has helped forward the community for the past 2 years.
But hey, it is the RC community you come to expect these comments from day to day.
I konw that sounded bad.(sorry Bp) Im just really trying to make a difference in the community. Im just trying to think of new ways that would make everyone happy. I know you are getting mods for both RC and Motr..or atleast thats what i understood.(might be wrong) but im just trying to purpose ideas to make it more of a community rather than 1 or 2 people running the show.
Posts: 78
Joined: 2006-03-15
User Profile First off id like to thank havick for re-opening this and explaining the scoring system. Finally sum1 has taken the time to do that. (i highly suggest u guys make a full version very easy to understnad and Pin that on these boards so that people can truely understand the scoring system and the way it works)
Vash, i am sorry but i said nothing inapropriate and i think it is way better that we discuss this instead of getting pissed and locking it...we need people to talk about what they feel is wrong and what er can do to make it better.
I like the idea of rotating game director...and i do agree that the community shuld have sum sort of say in our mods. I understand ER is not a playground and it isnt as easy as that but...the least u could do is have a few choices er chooses and let the community decide the mod.
Bp you say you wont give people moderator spots based off their clan. U kinda lose me here because this is a small community game. VERY SMALL, and i dont see the problem with Motr,RC,FS,7DS, and TX...or Im not even gonna name clan names, cause i dont want it to look like im excluding. But why cant the top 3 or 4 rated clans in the community have a moderator? I know i would feel alot better about ER if i had a clan mate i trusted as a mod here. Like i just dont understand why we cant have 5 or 6 mods with a representitive from the major clans.
Furthermore and more importantly i want to hear from every person who signed that petition, why they think there r problems with er, what these problems are and as a community look at it and see if their are mabe a few things we could do to make this community and our tornements ran more sucessfully and cooperatively.
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Monk the thing I know I take offance to is that; as you just said "one or two people run the show". The mods work their ass off to make an event run as smooth possible then people say that FS is running the show... I mean come on guys... I know I do things of this nature to justify losing a match "oh man he's CVing" crap like that... but when it comes down to it, at the end of the day you know they just played a better game and were on.
So please, can everybody that thinks FS runs the show get off it... Not only is there no evidance to back that claim up, but it's just flaming the people who you want to play matches against.
To address your pot Wrath, It applys to what I wa talking about to Monk... If you give a clan a mod just because they have been in the community for a little while,doesnt mean that person deservers it. It might promote them to do things just for their clan and ot for ER... as a mod for ER it's your job to be unatached to your clan. I was in DS before as a mod when I first got it. I aproched Bp for several reasons, at the time it was mostly so I could help keep DS inline with ER, but I learned that it was more that I was a mod who happend to be in DS. Not that I was a mod because I was in DS. Hope that makes since.
I'll get working on a better more offical post to pin about the scoring system.
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Location: USA
User Profile Wrath to expand upon what you said, but who decides on who the "top 3-4" clans of RC are? Who can do that and not bias? Also if someone isn't in a top clan they don't get to be a moderator? Lastly, what if a clan is was Top 3-4 and now not, do I have to dismiss a capable (trained) moderator?? This is why I prefer to a point moderators based on the individual. The other issue is that we don't need 5-6 moderators. Communication with 4 mods can sometimes be difficult.
Posts: 78
Joined: 2006-03-15
User Profile Who decides the top 4 clans...you scoring system.
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Okay Wrath, you were right... I was pissed but I had a cause ... every discussion about this ended into flaiming and that was something I didn't want again.
But this shows me that a normal talk is possible and that's fine.
And about your question "the top 4 or 5 clans":
This is not that easy Wrath. In almost every second tourney there is a new clan with you guys in it... Like "AG" or "7DS" or whatever ... So we would have to pick another mod from that "one hit wonder" clan.
And also it's impossible to decide by the scores, because some good players could create a new clan, would be in top 5 (what's not difficult) and would get a moderator job. Definetly we will not decide about new mods by clan's scores.
Posts: 24
Joined: 2006-03-16
Location: Lanark, Scotland
User Profile Ok, first, can someone please post a link to this petition? I just cannot find the thing :S
As for each clan having it's own Moderator at ER:
That would create say 10 more Mods. The clans in RC do not seem to get along very well. See where I'm going? Eventually it would lead to either the Mods being disbanded, or another Mod-Moderator group being created, where the same problems would crop up ie. "Wah [clan name here] is running the show". It's all rubbish to be honest, because if =FS= were running the show for themselves, no-one but =FS= would win. This is obvious.
As for rotating the Game Director position, why would we want to do that? BP is doing a great job, and if we had to rotate it, the 1st new GD would have a hell of a time of it trying to deal with setting up the tourny, sorting disputes etc. They wouldn't be used to it, and it would cause havoc to begin with and RC tournaments are already messy enough without ER getting screwed to hell. BP's used to it, so we'll just let him continue to suffer our little torments for now, hey? :p
My 2 cents so far, but keep going and it'll get sorted eventually.
Posts: 103
Joined: 2005-12-17
User Profile Yeah well, we have pretty much disbanded on the whole petition thing.
I basically think that all clans should be represented with 1 mod. The ONLY clan that is opposed is FS and TX. But seeing as they hold ALL of the power at this moment I can see why... It's fine that all current mods stay granting FS having 1 more mod than anyone and then just let the clan provide the nomination and then the current mod's have to agree that the nominated mod be accepted
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Yeah well, we have pretty much disbanded on the whole petition thing. I basically think that all clans should be represented with 1 mod. The ONLY clan that is opposed is FS and TX. But seeing as they hold ALL of the power at this moment I can see why... It's fine that all current mods stay granting FS having 1 more mod than anyone and then just let the clan provide the nomination and then the current mod's have to agree that the nominated mod be accepted
You're not getting it...
I was a mod long before I joined FS. But not only that it has nothing to do with what clan I am in, or anyone else. It's about people who want to help make events run and help our the site ER... not better the clans presance here or help push their clan to the top.... It's wrong to think that and that is why I am against having a clan have a mod just because they are a clan... They do things for the betterment of their clan and not ER.
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Flash I guess we already understood what you and some other people mean ... please don't say it 10 times that every clan needs a mod on ER.. if you got any other suggestions/ideas please post it.
Not the same all the time please. Thanks.
Posts: 34
Joined: 2006-01-14
Location: Aloha, Or
User Profile I love ER I pretty much only play this game for the tournaments anymore...
However the only Mod currently available to MotR members via xfire is TX Vash who happens to be up when most of us are asleep so yea there you go...
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile However the only Mod currently available to MotR members via xfire is TX Vash who happens to be up when most of us are asleep so yea there you go...
Well ... timezones are really annoying ... but I see many US people online when I'm on ... but not you Fish ... not really often .
Posts: 9
Joined: 2006-06-21
Location: Palm Coast, FL
User Profile Mods have PM boxes for a reason...you dont have to catch them on xfire to talk to them.
Posts: 12
Joined: 2007-10-14
User Profile Well pretty much Vash this is what's up. Fish isn't 6 hours behind you he's 9 so that only makes the timezone difference even worse.
As for Wrath's idea about every clan having 1 Moderator. I somewhat agree and disagree because some clans only play in some tourneys like =Tag= while =FS=, 7DS, -RC- and MotR pretty much play in every single tournament that is held here at ER i think that those 4 clans that i mentioned above should have atleast 1 moderator. Well you might think that there's a problem with that too having 4 more mods selected so i suggest that you propose the mod i.e (Bill) So you yourselves chose the next moderator and not the clan.
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile Well pretty much Vash this is what's up. Fish isn't 6 hours behind you he's 9 so that only makes the timezone difference even worse.
As for Wrath's idea about every clan having 1 Moderator. I somewhat agree and disagree because some clans only play in some tourneys like =Tag= while =FS=, 7DS, -RC- and MotR pretty much play in every single tournament that is held here at ER i think that those 4 clans that i mentioned above should have atleast 1 moderator. Well you might think that there's a problem with that too having 4 more mods selected so i suggest that you propose the mod i.e (Bill) So you yourselves chose the next moderator and not the clan.
and TX. and ash, its a lot easier to have a conversation about something over xfire. I know disputes are to be made over PM, but if it was a question about something, it would be so much easier just to be like, Hey Havick I got a question. or soemthing like that.
Posts: 12
Joined: 2007-10-14
User Profile Woops didn't read your post my bad. I think that Pm's should be for questions about the ER site such as Usernames ect. cause sometimes you guys aren't on when I am so for a last resort i do Pm Bprendy ect. But in the end Pm's should be for Complaints, Reports, and as for last resorts when you can't conatct them on xfire. But yeea xfire is easier cause I think Bp's inbox is already flooded enough.
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile As most of you are know I removed a fair amount of people from my Xfire... Being a mod yeah, it's probably best of have people on your Xfire in the community...
However, I removed most people because of constant Xfires about things that I really don't care to even talk about. People asking for matches, people wanting to know the next tounry (it's on the ER forums!), people wanting to say random crap just because they can. I have a pretty busy life as it is and having 5 different MotR people ask me for a schim every night doesn't make i any easier.(Im not picking on you, but you all know how many schims you have all asked for.)
PM boxes are a better place to ask questions for several reasons. 1. there is an aoutomatic chat log there which you dont have with Xfire unless you have it set to it. 2. It gives mods more time to think about the question an awnser it accordingly. I'll tell you all right now, I look at the ER forums at least 2-3 times a day. I almost never have a PM; so if you have a question PM me and I can help you.
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile As most of you are know I removed a fair amount of people from my Xfire... Being a mod yeah, it's probably best of have people on your Xfire in the community...
However, I removed most people because of constant Xfires about things that I really don't care to even talk about. People asking for matches, people wanting to know the next tounry (it's on the ER forums!), people wanting to say random crap just because they can. I have a pretty busy life as it is and having 5 different MotR people ask me for a schim every night doesn't make i any easier.(Im not picking on you, but you all know how many schims you have all asked for.)
PM boxes are a better place to ask questions for several reasons. 1. there is an aoutomatic chat log there which you dont have with Xfire unless you have it set to it. 2. It gives mods more time to think about the question an awnser it accordingly. I'll tell you all right now, I look at the ER forums at least 2-3 times a day. I almost never have a PM; so if you have a question PM me and I can help you.
Good point, i see where you are coming from there.
Posts: 12
Joined: 2007-10-14
User Profile Havick maybe I asked for 1 match but I never had you on my xfire....
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Joined: 2005-06-08
Location: USA
User Profile I don't sign into xfire much b/c I get spammed to the degree that I never get to play (during or outside of events b/c everyone thinks their problem is priority 1).. PMs should be the first line for any communication to a moderator. If they need to speak with you over xfire or other means they will send you PM or track you down. Fish as far as Vash being the only moderator available for MotR, I don't understand that one bit... I guess I should just forward the 20+ PMs I got from MotR members last event to Vash? Point is that there really isn't nothing that has be decided immediatel during an event.. moderators have lives and also would like to actually play at some point. PM is the best way for us to balance our time.. If your not getting a reply from a moderator send me one, or post a message on the forums. NOTE I'm not saying post your issue, but post a message, like "Hey I sent a PM to Havick and didn't hear back could a moderator please contact me".
Posts: 233
Joined: 2006-01-22
Location: USA
User Profile Havick maybe I asked for 1 match but I never had you on my xfire....
There is nothing personal about who I removed from my Xfire... I only have kept the people I talk to on a fairly regular bases and those that have never really bugged me for a match.
I am in college and as Bp said PMs are by far the best way to communicate something with a mod...
Enough on this subject though, if you have conserns please post them.
Posts: 32
Joined: 2006-03-02
Location: Canada
User Profile Having a moderator from every clan would greatly increase the number of mods, thus making the events run much less smoothly. I agree that rotating Game Directors would cause too much chaos to be a viable plan.
Also, I just wanted to point something out: a person cannot be disbanded. An organization can, but not a person.
Posts: 94
Joined: 2005-07-10
Location: Alberta, Canada
User Profile I remember when we started RCF and everyone was complaining on how everyone wanted a mod from each clan, everyone thought this was some big competition thing, it was just a community and everyone got big hype over it. I dont understand the point of having a mod from each clan, who ever is mature enough to handle the job should handle it. Who ever created this petition has some nerve, everyone here tries there hardest to make you happy, and you guys just make it more tough on them. I wouldnt be suprised if ER Stopped these RC Tourneys because of these reasons. Wrath im glad how you brought this to attention and i thank you, but to whoever created that stupid petition gets a beating.
=FS= Talon
Republic Commando Federation Cheif of Staff
Vital Gaming Administrative Crew
Posts: 94
Joined: 2005-07-10
Location: Alberta, Canada
User Profile Also on a side note, from reading posts. People asking for mods from there clan makes it sound like a war.
To "represent our clan", this isnt a fasion contest or some dress-up my pony and get $50 bucks. These mods do not represent there clan at all. Our =FS= Guys dont represent us, yeah they wear =FS= Tags, but all they do is manage your complaints and your idiocy with reporting wrong things (no not all people are idiots). But get your mind straitened out and go get a chocolate muffin or a drink!
Tal
Posts: 128
Joined: 2006-09-03
User Profile Hard words Tal and I have to agree on your opinion in my point of view...
This is really the truth what he is talking about and people should try to accept/understand it finally.
Posts: 12
Joined: 2007-10-14
User Profile Yea. Now I do see how screwed up we are making it on you guys... I have a question
Did anybody ever thank them for setting up these tournaments every month?
Posts: 103
Joined: 2005-12-17
User Profile No creed, most people don't. How would you go about thanking mods? The ONLY mod i EVER see is Vash. Havick I see every now and then. That is the same case for most people unless you are in the same clan and you can use the forums.
In that case, how would you go about thanking them?
Makes post on clan forums = spammed forums
Make post of ER forums = spammed forums
Send PM = 100 PM's to open (if you were a mod would you HONESTLY take your time to read through ALL of them sincerely?)
xfire = vash is the only person i ever see on... considering i am on around 7 hours a day i wud assume that wud be the same case for more people.
Bprendy does have a valid reason to get on considering he would be overwhelmed with xfires... As do most other mods its just bp wud get it the most
Posts: 48
Joined: 2006-01-26
Location: North Carolina
User Profile Just end this poop...Im tired of arguing and im cool with ER now cuz they got another mod..
Posts: 103
Joined: 2005-12-17
User Profile yea we rly dont need this topic....
anyways, what is dude's xfire?
Posts: 24
Joined: 2006-03-16
Location: Lanark, Scotland
User Profile thedude7777
in my profile too, just can't get my sig to work.
Posts: 32
Joined: 2006-03-02
Location: Canada
User Profile No creed, most people don't. How would you go about thanking mods?
I thank them if I talk to them about a question I have, but that's not really a general thanks, so I guess it doesn't count.
Posts: 9
Joined: 2006-06-21
Location: Palm Coast, FL
User Profile I don't think that a thread thanking the mods would be considered spam.